Does anybody have a step by step process for accomplishing this annoying task where the engine will start and stay started after the change out? I have successfully completed this operation every time I've attempted it but not without spending at least an hour priming and bleeding until the engine finally starts. After initially installing the filter, the engine will start right away but will die just about as quickly. After endless trips to the engine room with much effort the engine will finally start and stay lit.
Changing the Perkins engine mounted fuel filter
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larry_dyer
Larry Dyer
Be sure to fill the fuel filter can w/clean fuel before installing. I keep a 1-gal can with a small spout for this purpose. This, and a quick bleed at the next fitting in line should be all that's necessary.
jose santin
Member
After changing the filter, loosen the fuel fitting going to the injection pump, work the mechanical fuel pump on the side of the engine ( or turn on the electric feed pump) until fuel is coming out through the loosened fitting. Tighten the fitting and pump some more until resistance is felt on the pump. After this loosen the injector fuel line that is closest to you. Turn the engine over until you see fuel squirting out of the fitting. This works for me assuming no air leaks when replacing gaskets on the CAV filter. This sometimes happens, beware of off brand filters.
There is a bleed screw on the injector pump body also, this needs to be bleed as a next step if you run the engine completely out of fuel.
For the newer engines with the BOMAR heat exchanger, there is a kit to change out the CAV filter with a spin on type that can be pre-filled just like Larry mentions in the prev post.
There is a bleed screw on the injector pump body also, this needs to be bleed as a next step if you run the engine completely out of fuel.
For the newer engines with the BOMAR heat exchanger, there is a kit to change out the CAV filter with a spin on type that can be pre-filled just like Larry mentions in the prev post.
I have an electric in line fuel transfer pump up stream of the primary fuel filter and use it to fill both the primary filter and the engine mounted filter after they are changed out. For the past several years I have had no problem with almost immediate start of the engine after filter changes. I usually let the transfer pump run for about a minute then start the engine . I know there is air in the system and I don't know where it goes to, but the engine starts and runs
Bill Williams
Bill Williams
I definitely have the CAV non-prefillable, cannister engine type fuel filter and would love a spin-on model. We don't have the fuel issues in the Great Lakes that those of you in more humid climates have but a minimum of an annual change is my standard. Based on my serial # I have te new model 4-108 but I have no idea if it is with the Bomar heat exchanger.
The only fitting I bleed is the one on top that has has the return line on it and is the only really accessible point in the fuel system. This is of course unless I'm missing something with the location of the injector pump. I also like the notion of the inline electric fuel pump to cycle things through. Question: Do you still have to bleed the system when this is used?
The only fitting I bleed is the one on top that has has the return line on it and is the only really accessible point in the fuel system. This is of course unless I'm missing something with the location of the injector pump. I also like the notion of the inline electric fuel pump to cycle things through. Question: Do you still have to bleed the system when this is used?
Alan, I've had the in-line pump installed for about 4 years now. When I replace either filter, I don't prefill them either. My engine filter is like yours, and there is no way I could prefill it. I only put the filter on, and in the case of the primary (Racor) I put the top on, then turn the transfer pump on and let it run for about a minute . Then I hit the start switch, and the engine starts and runs. There have only been 2 or 3 times I've had to open the bleed valve on the side of the injector pump. I know there is air in the system the way I do it, and I have no idea what happens to it as I run the pump to fill the system. So, generally I don't bleed the system.
terrythatcher
Terry Thatcher
Alan, I just did this job. Bleeding a Perkins is a bit of a chore and it will not work well unless you work on several different adjusting nuts in turn. I have two on the high pressure pump/governor assembly and then I open up the pipes to each injector after I have bled the air out of the pump assembly. I bought the replacement spin on filter only to learn it will not fit because of the placement of what I believe is part of the cooling system. Too bad, the current filter is a bitch. My only advice is to keep a good primary filter ahead of the engine filter, a Racor or something, and so you need not worry so much about the engine filter. It is a problem. I have a little Perkins manual that shows the steps to bleed --with some that are unnecessary in my experience. If I remember, which is not terrible likely, I will try to copy the pages and send them to you.
I have a complete Perkins manual so no need for the copying. I have never had to bleed any other points except the return line fitting although bleeding the others would probably have speeded up the restart. I have a Racor (200 series) in front of the engine filter but have not replaced that since new in 2000. I plan to attack that task next year because right now "if it ain't broke" I'm not replacing it. I would guess that filter only has 50 hours use. The engine ran until 2000 with only the original water separator which I replaced with the Racor (filter/separator).
jose santin
Member
Alan
As Terry found out you can't put a spin on primary on the old marinizing setup. The Bomar heat exchanger is the one that has the reservoir and heat exchanger along with the exhaust manifold on the port side of the boat. The old system has the reservoir and coolant filler cap on the front of the engine and the heat exchanger is on the back of the engine block on brackets.
The injector pump requires bleeding only if you have run the system dry. Priming all filters before attempting to start the engine will usually eliminate the need for this.
As Terry found out you can't put a spin on primary on the old marinizing setup. The Bomar heat exchanger is the one that has the reservoir and heat exchanger along with the exhaust manifold on the port side of the boat. The old system has the reservoir and coolant filler cap on the front of the engine and the heat exchanger is on the back of the engine block on brackets.
The injector pump requires bleeding only if you have run the system dry. Priming all filters before attempting to start the engine will usually eliminate the need for this.
Alan, sorry for the delay in answering, but the boat was struck by lightning Tuesday night and I've been busy setting things up with the insurance co. and setting up for bids. It's said that Florida is the lightning capital of the US and now I believe it. 7 boats in my marina were struck .
Anyway- the pump is simply an in line diesel truck fuel pump I got at NAPA Auto Parts. There is no longer a maker label on it, so I don't know who the manufacturer is. Cost was in the high $40's when I bought in about 4 years ago.
Bill
Anyway- the pump is simply an in line diesel truck fuel pump I got at NAPA Auto Parts. There is no longer a maker label on it, so I don't know who the manufacturer is. Cost was in the high $40's when I bought in about 4 years ago.
Bill
Derrick Sindorf
New Member
I have two questions: first our boat is a 70' CM38 with a Perkins 4108. I have had to change our CAV filter twice and have thus far avoided the sealing issues many complain about. I have not avoided the nightmare inducing process of bleeding the entire system to the injectors after these two changes. So, first question is, has anyone experienced ease of bleeding after a spin on conversion? If not, than I will just save the money and stick with the CAV setup, I can change the filter fairly neatly in about 20 minutes as I have excellent rear engine access. I was considering a fuel pump for bleeding purposes but was actually steered towards an outboard primer bulb as an alternative. Will install that this week. I guess the idea is that the stock lift pump flows very little so having a greater volume through a primer bulb or electric pump is more likely to push bubbles through more rapidly. Any input would be great, if the engine goes down for any reason in a seaway the priming process and time would put the vessel in danger. I am looking for members direct experience with the Perkins 4108. THANKS
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stnick
lee nicholas
I installed a electric pump right after the fuel filter K &N 33810402 about $45 bucks . wire it to the power at the switch. This insures that when i change filters the the fuel flows. i just get out the wrench and crack the injector nut . You will see air bubbles and than the engine starts. !
I even took RED nail polish and painted the nut so next time I could locate it . I also use it to mark the water temp gage for to high to stop over heating . I have one of these pumps on the generator also. And that bleed nut is painted red also . Just makes it quicker and faster.
My open end wrench set that wrench is painted red too ! Just easier !
I even took RED nail polish and painted the nut so next time I could locate it . I also use it to mark the water temp gage for to high to stop over heating . I have one of these pumps on the generator also. And that bleed nut is painted red also . Just makes it quicker and faster.
My open end wrench set that wrench is painted red too ! Just easier !
Derrick Sindorf
New Member
Thanks for the response! So, the electric pump you have installed runs full time anytime the engine is running, correct? I guess that is harmless as any excesses pressure the pump would create would just send more fuel back on the recirculation loop. And to clarify, you will crank the engine with the injector nut(s) cracked and the pump is aiding in the fuel flowing more rapidly through the CAV pump with a bit of positive pressure. It will usually take me a good 10 minutes of cranking (on and off in short bursts to prevent starter damage) to get dips out of all the injector lines - does it take you that long with the pump upgrade? I don't mean to hijack this thread so sorry if this is becoming about my woes - I think there are a lot of other people who share my headaches though. Thanks again!
Once I figured out how to bleed our 4.108 it was quite easy and I can do it in a couple of minutes. I don't have a lift pump.
I had real problems finding the various parts of the engine while referring to the Perkins manual.
So I took some photos & notes and posted on our blog
See if this helps:
http://readyabout.net/?p=47
I hope everyone has a Merry Christmas!
I had real problems finding the various parts of the engine while referring to the Perkins manual.
So I took some photos & notes and posted on our blog
See if this helps:
http://readyabout.net/?p=47
I hope everyone has a Merry Christmas!
stnick
lee nicholas
Yes the electric pumps fuel all the time. ! Every time i changed the filter i had trouble starting ! Even used starting fluid sometimes , used to use WD -40 before they changed the formula , now it doesn't work !! With the electric pump turn the key use someone else to turn the key and crack the nut of the first injector it will bubble and the engine will start to sputter. Close the nut and mine starts every time. For me this is One minute in time !
I don't even get upset any more its just part of the process. Just go get my red wrench and turn the red nut ! The Perkins is new blue so its easy to find.
I don't even get upset any more its just part of the process. Just go get my red wrench and turn the red nut ! The Perkins is new blue so its easy to find.
jose santin
Member
An electric pump is nice, but you must remember that in case of a leak in the fuel system you might pump your fuel tank into your bilge. I was once told that a bulb in the fuel line is not CG approved. The mechanical pump on the side of the engine can be manually operated for fuel system purging. Just some observations....
dave_a
Dave Ahlers
A couple thoughts.
Look at Facet fuel pumps. They sell a wide variety of pumps, one will fit your needs. Available at most auto parts stores.
You can pump through most Facets when it is "off" (specs will say) So wire up a switch and use it as an emegency pump for bleeding or IF the mechanical Perkins pump fails.
A Perkins Filter is a 10 micron grade. IF you have a 2 micron Racor before the engine your Perkins engine filter will live a long, long life. (mine's 5 yrs old)
An in-line Racor fuel line vacuum gauge allows the skipper to monitor the filter condition. Filter clogging is typically a process that occurs over time. The gauge gives you fair warning that your fuel & filter are dirty. The gauge fits nicely where my dead Hobbs hour meter resided in the instrument panel.
http://www.cruisingworld.com/how/fuel-filter-gauge
Look at Facet fuel pumps. They sell a wide variety of pumps, one will fit your needs. Available at most auto parts stores.
You can pump through most Facets when it is "off" (specs will say) So wire up a switch and use it as an emegency pump for bleeding or IF the mechanical Perkins pump fails.
A Perkins Filter is a 10 micron grade. IF you have a 2 micron Racor before the engine your Perkins engine filter will live a long, long life. (mine's 5 yrs old)
An in-line Racor fuel line vacuum gauge allows the skipper to monitor the filter condition. Filter clogging is typically a process that occurs over time. The gauge gives you fair warning that your fuel & filter are dirty. The gauge fits nicely where my dead Hobbs hour meter resided in the instrument panel.
http://www.cruisingworld.com/how/fuel-filter-gauge