Warren Holybee
Active Member
This begins today. I hope by the end of the day to have the old box out.
Ice Box Rebuild
- Thread starter Warren Holybee
- Start date
Warren Holybee
Active Member
This is how far i got. About 4 or 5 hours, not including the dust /scrap clean up im still doing. That bit under the cabinet I've not had any luck with. It seems to be glued in place with 5200.
I started with removing all the screws in the top. A hole saw around the bolts made short work of that problem. Then i cut along the cabinet side. I hoped to get the top off otherwise in one piece, and maybe to reuse it. No luck, in addition to all the screws, an ample amount of 5200 was holding it down. So, cutting around the edge as others did, and lots of prying and hammering a chisel to cut through the 5200, and got it off.
I'm still going to do more work cutting around the edge and removing more of the top. But its mostly off, unfortunately i don't think ill be able to reuse it.
Then cutting and prying all the other bits. It sucked, but at least except for the last bit under the cabinet wasn't difficult.
I started with removing all the screws in the top. A hole saw around the bolts made short work of that problem. Then i cut along the cabinet side. I hoped to get the top off otherwise in one piece, and maybe to reuse it. No luck, in addition to all the screws, an ample amount of 5200 was holding it down. So, cutting around the edge as others did, and lots of prying and hammering a chisel to cut through the 5200, and got it off.
I'm still going to do more work cutting around the edge and removing more of the top. But its mostly off, unfortunately i don't think ill be able to reuse it.
Then cutting and prying all the other bits. It sucked, but at least except for the last bit under the cabinet wasn't difficult.
terry_thatcher
Terence Thatcher
Does it look like Morgan forgot to glass the aft bulkhead to the hull? Maybe they only did it on the aft side?
Good luck with the project.
I didn't want to do this, having seen pictures of others' demolition. Instead I purchased a bunch of vacuum panels encased in fiberglass, and installed those in the old box. Basically made a jigsaw puzzle of vacuum panels. Over those I put blue board and then a plastic covering. Made the box smaller, but it seemed too big anyway. R value of the vacuum and blue board is 45. Of course, there are seams of fiberglass where the panels butt up against each other, where there will be essentially no R value. That is why I put the blue board over the panels, to add some R and to prevent air leakage around the panels.
Good luck with the project.
I didn't want to do this, having seen pictures of others' demolition. Instead I purchased a bunch of vacuum panels encased in fiberglass, and installed those in the old box. Basically made a jigsaw puzzle of vacuum panels. Over those I put blue board and then a plastic covering. Made the box smaller, but it seemed too big anyway. R value of the vacuum and blue board is 45. Of course, there are seams of fiberglass where the panels butt up against each other, where there will be essentially no R value. That is why I put the blue board over the panels, to add some R and to prevent air leakage around the panels.
Terry - regarding tabbing between bulkhead and hull - Zia (1983 384) has this black epoxy-like stuff. See the black stuff on the bottom joints of the photo below. I don’t know exactly what it is, but it’s rock hard and very tough. I tried chipping out a piece and it didn’t budge. I’m happy with this stuff in lieu of more conventional tabbing.
Based on Robert and Warren’s photos, it doesn’t look like all M38s have the black epoxy stuff.
Based on Robert and Warren’s photos, it doesn’t look like all M38s have the black epoxy stuff.
Warren Holybee
Active Member
Interesting that that black stuff is oozing out of the cutout my factory bilge pump hose runs through. Did Zia not have a hose there?
My understanding of the "best" way to tab a bulkhead. You both do not want the bulkhead to touch the hull because it will distort and create a visible line on the outside, and also want to fillet the corner before laying the fiberglass tape. So, glue it in place holding it about 1/4" away from the hull, and make a fillet with the glue. Then tab over that. Anyway, If I had to guess, maybe that is what the "black stuff" is for. It also seems like it might be what is under the mast bucket.
My understanding of the "best" way to tab a bulkhead. You both do not want the bulkhead to touch the hull because it will distort and create a visible line on the outside, and also want to fillet the corner before laying the fiberglass tape. So, glue it in place holding it about 1/4" away from the hull, and make a fillet with the glue. Then tab over that. Anyway, If I had to guess, maybe that is what the "black stuff" is for. It also seems like it might be what is under the mast bucket.
Yeah, I see your bilge pump pipe and what I’m guessing is the (grey polybutylene) shower drain discharge running thru the bottom of your box. Those didn’t run thru the icebox on Zia. Bilge pipe is down along the centerline and goes thru the engine compartment. Shower discharge line goes up higher behind the stove and passes aft.
When I was cleaning out our fuel tank about 5 years ago, I also found some really big chunks of the black stuff that were loose and bobbing around in the fuel tank. Must have been in there since she was built because I had to break them up to get them out of the fill hole.
When I was cleaning out our fuel tank about 5 years ago, I also found some really big chunks of the black stuff that were loose and bobbing around in the fuel tank. Must have been in there since she was built because I had to break them up to get them out of the fill hole.
Warren Holybee
Active Member
I am wondering about the hoses. Through the engine compartment is better, and where the aftermarket hose for the electric pump goes. I want to square off the space to make it more usable, and to maintain 4" of insulation, that puts the floor 4" above the hose. I lose a lot of space by doing that. With insulation considered, the box really isn't that big. I am(was) hoping for about 1cf of freezer and 3cf of refrigerator. That is pretty small imho for long term cruising, and I don't think I can do it. At least not without an awkward shaped space and VIP panels to reduce insulation thickness.
But damn, I really need to get back to using my boat, and after 6 months for a "simple" floor repair, I am about ready to throw $10,000 at someone to have this done next week, so moving hoses isn't likely. I don't mind working on my boat, but I hate having projects going on that affect it's use.
But damn, I really need to get back to using my boat, and after 6 months for a "simple" floor repair, I am about ready to throw $10,000 at someone to have this done next week, so moving hoses isn't likely. I don't mind working on my boat, but I hate having projects going on that affect it's use.
Warren Holybee
Active Member
Referring to this post: https://www.morgan38.org/morgan38/index.php?threads/icebox-rebuild.15257/post-127825
Jim, what are the dimensions of your evaporator? Is the temperature balance of freezer to refrigerator good, or is the fridge too warm or cold when the freezer is down near 15F? Would you change the configuration if you did it again?
What I had wanted, is that I have a flat 54" by 12" evaporator. I wanted to fold that into a ~ 12x12x12 cube, and tuck it as close as I could to the cabinets. Then have two lids, one for the fridge and one for the freezer. But I can't fit a cube that size anywhere near the cabinet, it would wind up in the middle. And I had wanted 6" of insulation for the freezer part, that just can't happen, the space is too small. So, I am looking at other configurations. I may need to buy a new evaporator, which I think right now are basically unavailable.
Jim, what are the dimensions of your evaporator? Is the temperature balance of freezer to refrigerator good, or is the fridge too warm or cold when the freezer is down near 15F? Would you change the configuration if you did it again?
What I had wanted, is that I have a flat 54" by 12" evaporator. I wanted to fold that into a ~ 12x12x12 cube, and tuck it as close as I could to the cabinets. Then have two lids, one for the fridge and one for the freezer. But I can't fit a cube that size anywhere near the cabinet, it would wind up in the middle. And I had wanted 6" of insulation for the freezer part, that just can't happen, the space is too small. So, I am looking at other configurations. I may need to buy a new evaporator, which I think right now are basically unavailable.
Warren Holybee
Active Member
I might take you up on that.
Warren Holybee
Active Member
Vern, What brand aerogel do you have?
terry_thatcher
Terence Thatcher
Just be careful with the vacuum foam that you don't damage the seal while installing it. I doubted my competence, which is why I purchased the fiberglass encased panels. But it wasn't cheap.
jimcleary
James M. Cleary
Warren
A couple of thoughts on your project. In the archives there should be photos from when we rebuilt Dana's box. The original box with the poured in foam insulation was hastily made to hold about 100 lbs of block ice and your food stuff. By going to refridgeration you don't need that much space any longer, and you don't want to be cooling it all anyway. Our box ended up at about 6 cubic feet. It has been plenty of room for the long cruising we have done. When you removed the old foam from the curved bottom of the box, you found that the hull was the outer liner of the box. Build the new bottom off the hull to leave an air space between to insulate from the sea water temps. When you have finished building the new box, before you install your insulation, line the box completely using aluminum foil and mylar paper. The mylar is a perfect vapor barrier. The aluminum foil with the shiny side out will reflect any radiant heat away from the box, especially from the engine compartment. Both layers were installed using spray on adhesive. We used two 2" layers of blue styrofoam with all seams sealed with latex chalk.
Our system is the Frigaboat with the keel cooler. It is amazingly efficient. The evaporator in the box is about 16" long, 5" wide by 12" deep. I'm guessing those numbers but they are close. The evaporator will hold four of the silicone ice trays and freezes the ice nicely. Anything above the ice trays in the evaporator will stay frozen. The rest if the box is set at 37-38 degrees.
I know it is a big project but when your done you will be very happy. Hope this helps a bit.
Jim
A couple of thoughts on your project. In the archives there should be photos from when we rebuilt Dana's box. The original box with the poured in foam insulation was hastily made to hold about 100 lbs of block ice and your food stuff. By going to refridgeration you don't need that much space any longer, and you don't want to be cooling it all anyway. Our box ended up at about 6 cubic feet. It has been plenty of room for the long cruising we have done. When you removed the old foam from the curved bottom of the box, you found that the hull was the outer liner of the box. Build the new bottom off the hull to leave an air space between to insulate from the sea water temps. When you have finished building the new box, before you install your insulation, line the box completely using aluminum foil and mylar paper. The mylar is a perfect vapor barrier. The aluminum foil with the shiny side out will reflect any radiant heat away from the box, especially from the engine compartment. Both layers were installed using spray on adhesive. We used two 2" layers of blue styrofoam with all seams sealed with latex chalk.
Our system is the Frigaboat with the keel cooler. It is amazingly efficient. The evaporator in the box is about 16" long, 5" wide by 12" deep. I'm guessing those numbers but they are close. The evaporator will hold four of the silicone ice trays and freezes the ice nicely. Anything above the ice trays in the evaporator will stay frozen. The rest if the box is set at 37-38 degrees.
I know it is a big project but when your done you will be very happy. Hope this helps a bit.
Jim
I purchased from PACOR. MFG Aspen Aerogel
Warren Holybee
Active Member
Yeah, that's the basic and standard construction, and not my problems I am concerned about. The physical construction is easy. First is time. It took me more than 6 months to do what should have been a 2 week job on the floor repair, which still needs 2 trim pieces made, but I don't have the tools handy (buried in a shed at my fathers place). I have at best 1 day per week to work on the boat, and that is assuming I give up anything else I might want to do.(which I am really exhausted from and need a life back) I just don't have any personal time for anything with my current employment schedule. It just isn't sustainable, but it is what I have right now.
The other issue is the box size and shape. I am surprised Jim got 6cf out of it. I am trying to make it "usable" by squaring it up, so I can reach the bottom and so the bottom is flat and I can stack stuff well. I am coming up to about 3.5 cf total. 2.5 cf for a refrigerator section, and 1 cf for a freezer. That is a *lot* smaller than I want. The plan was to have two separate lids, not unlike the stock configuration, with the lid closest to the cabinet a 1 cf freezer, and the other a 2.5 cf fridge. Except that a 1 cf space won't quite fit where I need it too. My evaporator is 54" x 12". It will fold into a cube about 13.5"x13.5"x12" high. Front to back, the inside of my box will be about 14", so it _just_ fits that way. But I can't put it next to the cabinet, so it massively shrinks the fridge. That is why I was wondering about Jim's evaporator. Unfortunately, folded into a rectangle like his instead of a cube, It will still be almost 2x the size of his.
So yesterday I started looking at replacing the evaporator, only to discover that the kit I have, purchased used but still new-in-box, has an older connector style, and will not work with any currently available separate evaporators. I haven't decided what to do. I can by a new evaporator, then pay a tech to replace the connectors on my compressor, or buy a whole new kit.
The evaporator size I am looking at is 47.5" by 7.5" which will fold into 12x12x7.5. That I can tuck next to the cabinet, and will a slopped bottom from 7.5 inches to about 12 inches will give me about 0.8 cf. A bit smaller than I wanted, but workable. I would prefer the larger 54x12 evaporator for power to bring a warm fish to freezing faster, but it is just to big to fit.
I bought Nigel Calder's book, and using formula's in it an from other sources calculating what my expected Ah per day usage will be with various options. It's difficult to justify aerogel. Without aerogel and assuming being in the tropics, I am looking at less than 40Ah per day with 4 inches of foam. I will probably be less than that because I will have much more than 4" on the bottom. Aerogel could drop that to 35, or maybe 30, and I still would not be able to reduce the insulation thickness. I'm just not sure it is worth it. VIP panels are more tempting. With them I could drop it to close to 20Ah per day. But even then, 40Ah per day is pretty efficient, and much less than I was using running 2 chest boxes previously. (about 100Ah in the tropics) And for comparison, with the chest boxes, I has 2.5 cf of fridge, and 1.5 cf of freezer. It worked, but I definitely felt squeezed for space.
The other issue is the box size and shape. I am surprised Jim got 6cf out of it. I am trying to make it "usable" by squaring it up, so I can reach the bottom and so the bottom is flat and I can stack stuff well. I am coming up to about 3.5 cf total. 2.5 cf for a refrigerator section, and 1 cf for a freezer. That is a *lot* smaller than I want. The plan was to have two separate lids, not unlike the stock configuration, with the lid closest to the cabinet a 1 cf freezer, and the other a 2.5 cf fridge. Except that a 1 cf space won't quite fit where I need it too. My evaporator is 54" x 12". It will fold into a cube about 13.5"x13.5"x12" high. Front to back, the inside of my box will be about 14", so it _just_ fits that way. But I can't put it next to the cabinet, so it massively shrinks the fridge. That is why I was wondering about Jim's evaporator. Unfortunately, folded into a rectangle like his instead of a cube, It will still be almost 2x the size of his.
So yesterday I started looking at replacing the evaporator, only to discover that the kit I have, purchased used but still new-in-box, has an older connector style, and will not work with any currently available separate evaporators. I haven't decided what to do. I can by a new evaporator, then pay a tech to replace the connectors on my compressor, or buy a whole new kit.
The evaporator size I am looking at is 47.5" by 7.5" which will fold into 12x12x7.5. That I can tuck next to the cabinet, and will a slopped bottom from 7.5 inches to about 12 inches will give me about 0.8 cf. A bit smaller than I wanted, but workable. I would prefer the larger 54x12 evaporator for power to bring a warm fish to freezing faster, but it is just to big to fit.
I bought Nigel Calder's book, and using formula's in it an from other sources calculating what my expected Ah per day usage will be with various options. It's difficult to justify aerogel. Without aerogel and assuming being in the tropics, I am looking at less than 40Ah per day with 4 inches of foam. I will probably be less than that because I will have much more than 4" on the bottom. Aerogel could drop that to 35, or maybe 30, and I still would not be able to reduce the insulation thickness. I'm just not sure it is worth it. VIP panels are more tempting. With them I could drop it to close to 20Ah per day. But even then, 40Ah per day is pretty efficient, and much less than I was using running 2 chest boxes previously. (about 100Ah in the tropics) And for comparison, with the chest boxes, I has 2.5 cf of fridge, and 1.5 cf of freezer. It worked, but I definitely felt squeezed for space.
Warren Holybee
Active Member
That is standard with all makes now. They all use the same secop BD35/BD50 compressor. Even my dometic iceboxes use secop compressors with variable speed.
Also note, I am talking about Amp Hours, not Amps. 2 Amps for 24 hours is 48 Amp hours. I am targeting 35-40 Ah per day, which is less than 2 Amps average. With a 300Ah battery, that would run my fridge for about a week.
I am certainly going to look at the Frigoboat if I am stuck buying something new, but I am not there yet, and I already have a BD50 compressor that will work with any brand system/evaporator, if I have someone change the connectors. It's just that my system, sized for a 14 cubic foot box, is just physically very large to fit in the smaller box on our boat.
Also note, I am talking about Amp Hours, not Amps. 2 Amps for 24 hours is 48 Amp hours. I am targeting 35-40 Ah per day, which is less than 2 Amps average. With a 300Ah battery, that would run my fridge for about a week.
I am certainly going to look at the Frigoboat if I am stuck buying something new, but I am not there yet, and I already have a BD50 compressor that will work with any brand system/evaporator, if I have someone change the connectors. It's just that my system, sized for a 14 cubic foot box, is just physically very large to fit in the smaller box on our boat.
struell
Stephen Ruell
Warren, I realize that you are well into this project but you haven't purchased all your materials yet, you could consider one of the electric cooler units. If you find one that would fit, you could save yourself a lot of work by converting the space of the old ice box into a simple shelf to hold a cooler in place of the old ice box.
We got tired of the old ice box not keeping anything cold and I couldn't face the size of the project to rebuild it and install refrigeration. We took a different approach and bought a Dometic electric cooler that we anchored to one of the settees. It works really well, has two compartments that are separately controlled and can be either freezers or refrigerators, runs on 12VDC or 120VAC, and seems to do fine with the power available from the solar panel. The Dometic units seem to be very well made, and are probably more aimed at the RV and camping market.
We are now using the old ice box for other kinds of galley storage. It is in pretty good shape cosmetically but won't keep anything cold, but that is OK now, and I don't have to tear it out.
Everything on a boat is a compromise of course, so giving up half of that settee is a big choice to make, but we haven't regretted it. We seldom seat a lot of people around the table and don't need it as a bed, so it hasn't been a problem yet. If we had it to do again I think we could have purchased a smaller cooler and put it in the place of the old ice box. I probably should have looked at that.
Steve
We got tired of the old ice box not keeping anything cold and I couldn't face the size of the project to rebuild it and install refrigeration. We took a different approach and bought a Dometic electric cooler that we anchored to one of the settees. It works really well, has two compartments that are separately controlled and can be either freezers or refrigerators, runs on 12VDC or 120VAC, and seems to do fine with the power available from the solar panel. The Dometic units seem to be very well made, and are probably more aimed at the RV and camping market.
We are now using the old ice box for other kinds of galley storage. It is in pretty good shape cosmetically but won't keep anything cold, but that is OK now, and I don't have to tear it out.
Everything on a boat is a compromise of course, so giving up half of that settee is a big choice to make, but we haven't regretted it. We seldom seat a lot of people around the table and don't need it as a bed, so it hasn't been a problem yet. If we had it to do again I think we could have purchased a smaller cooler and put it in the place of the old ice box. I probably should have looked at that.
Steve
Attachments
Warren Holybee
Active Member
That is exactly what I have been doing, and my Dometic is/was in the same spot as you, with a smaller one next to it. But I am doing this to both gain that settee back, and to hopefully cut my power usage in half. Those are not insulated nearly as well as I will make mine. In the tropics they were cold and dripping wet with condensation on the outside, and running at a 100% duty cycle, really sucking the battery down.
I probably will miss the dry storage of the icebox, too. It was filled with all of my dry goods, flour, sugar, cereals, pastas, etc.
Warren Holybee
Active Member
Good progress today. As difficult as this project is made out to be, this is only the end of day 2. It's much easier and faster than fixing the dry rot in my sole was. It should look familiar as it is basically what others have done. The only radiant barrier the local home supply store had was the bubble wrap kind, so that it what I used.
One thing I did that I am not sure others did, is that after the space was squared off with 1/4 inch plywood, I filled the space beneath and behind it with expanding closed cell polyurethane foam. It is R6 per inch, same as the pink or blue board. At it's thinnest point, it is 2 inches. It it's thickest( at the very bottom near the engine bay, and at the top beneath the cabinets) it is > 8 inches. I made the floor very near level so the bottom will be reachable, and food will stack and store nicely. With just a bit of tilt forward and to the engine bay, so water can be collected there easiest.
I am just now able to really measure the space. I think my giant 54" by 12" evaporator will work. Mostly because of the polyurethane foam, I am only going to use 2" of foam board on the outside wall and the sloped part. But with the expanding foam, I will still average more than 6" of insulation, even with only 2" of it from the foam board. The space will work out to 1 cubic foot for the freezer, and 2 cubic feet for the fridge. The freezer will be ~12x12x12, and the fridge ~14x15x17. Smaller than I had hoped, but to get more would have left me with awkward difficult to use shapes, and less insulation. This box is going to be very practical in size and shape.
I haven't looked at the weather forecast for next weekend. If it is nice, I might skip working on this for a week and go sailing instead.
One thing I did that I am not sure others did, is that after the space was squared off with 1/4 inch plywood, I filled the space beneath and behind it with expanding closed cell polyurethane foam. It is R6 per inch, same as the pink or blue board. At it's thinnest point, it is 2 inches. It it's thickest( at the very bottom near the engine bay, and at the top beneath the cabinets) it is > 8 inches. I made the floor very near level so the bottom will be reachable, and food will stack and store nicely. With just a bit of tilt forward and to the engine bay, so water can be collected there easiest.
I am just now able to really measure the space. I think my giant 54" by 12" evaporator will work. Mostly because of the polyurethane foam, I am only going to use 2" of foam board on the outside wall and the sloped part. But with the expanding foam, I will still average more than 6" of insulation, even with only 2" of it from the foam board. The space will work out to 1 cubic foot for the freezer, and 2 cubic feet for the fridge. The freezer will be ~12x12x12, and the fridge ~14x15x17. Smaller than I had hoped, but to get more would have left me with awkward difficult to use shapes, and less insulation. This box is going to be very practical in size and shape.
I haven't looked at the weather forecast for next weekend. If it is nice, I might skip working on this for a week and go sailing instead.
terry_thatcher
Terence Thatcher
Expanding foam? Where will it go? Just interested in your project. I wish I had though of the radiant barrier, at least on the engine side of the box.
Warren Holybee
Active Member
The expanding foam went under the the plywood "floor" of the icebox, and between the wall of the icebox and the hull. I installed the plywood, then drilled some holes in it an poured the foam in. This gives me another couple of inches of insulation in addition to the foam boards.
Warren Holybee
Active Member
Day 3. The cube is a mockup of my evaporator. It measures to a 1 cubic foot freezer and 2.6 cubic foot fridge.
Nice! Sounds like your fridge is a little bigger than you previously thought. I can't find my dimensions now, but I believe they are similar.
What are you planning on doing for walls, bottom, and top?
I was a little ambitious when I did this about 5 years ago. Built a plywood "plug" that I took out and used for a mold for gelcoat and fiberglass. It ended up as a very nice sealed fiberglass box, but took a lot of time. Mostly calendar time because I had to wait between all the layers for things to dry/cure.
What are you planning on doing for walls, bottom, and top?
I was a little ambitious when I did this about 5 years ago. Built a plywood "plug" that I took out and used for a mold for gelcoat and fiberglass. It ended up as a very nice sealed fiberglass box, but took a lot of time. Mostly calendar time because I had to wait between all the layers for things to dry/cure.
Warren Holybee
Active Member
The plan for the sides is "FRP wallboard" from Home Depot. It is 1/8 inch thin, and I plan to epoxy laminate it to 1/4 plywood for structure. I cut the plywood and the wallboard today, and am gluing a test piece tonight. It's weird stuff. It cuts like fiberglass(has that nasty smell) and when you break it there are fibers, but not sure they are glass. And the resin is very flexible and not like epoxy at all. It will bend to about a 6" radius before it breaks. So I'm not sure exactly what it is, but I have read of others using it with success. But I want to glue up some pieces with epoxy and see what it it does. Maybe stick a piece in the freezer after it cures. I would hate for it to debond because of different thermal expansion than wood or something. The "correct" glue for it is contractors glue like liquid nails, but I don't think that would be the best in a freezer. I think fully laminating it with epoxy will be best.
For the top, I have a temporary and a permanent solution. The temporary solution is a plywood top with 2" of foam, no liner covering the foam, just leaving it exposed. Modifying the original lid by adding insulation, but otherwise keeping it the same. I will screw that down without glue or expanding foam on the seams so I can take it off again. The purpose is to be able to test the whole system and make adjustments if necessary. My system/evaporator is sized for a 14 foot box. I am concerned it will freeze the whole thing and won't work for a small split system. But with adjustments I hope to make it work, and be able to freeze a fresh fish in a few hours instead of a couple days.
The more permanent lid will be a custom made lid following the plans in Nigel's refrigeration book. His technique is a lot of work, but at the same time simple in concept and doesn't require special tools or skills. Basically, you start by making a surround out of thin wood that is not unlike the surround r-parts lids look like, with a stairstep double seal, etc. Then, once that is done and setup, use it as a mold and use thin wood to make the mating part of the lid. The lid is then finished off by filling the void with expanding foam. The whole thing is then put upside down on a bench, and glue the surround to the top, which will ensure the lid and top are flush. Then add necessary foam to the bottom of the top and finish it up.
I looked hard at the r-parts lids, but unless they can custom make one to the dimensions I need they won't fit as I want. I also considered getting "real" fiberglass sheets from them, but they are just a bit further than I want to drive. They are drivable though, and it was a though at one point to get the lids from them, VIP panels from them, and the fiberglass sheet, and just make the 2 1/2 hour drive to pick them up to save shipping.
My plan for the compressor is behind the waterheater, a bit under the cabinet in an area easily accessed with the floor of the food locker removed. The previous owner built a hidden shelf back there, possibly for this purpose. It has surprisingly good ventilation, almost ideal for this, drawing up from the bilge, and exhausting behind the cabinets toward the hull deck joint, eventually into the cockpit locker area. PVC pipe will connect that area to the freezer, and I will pack the pipe with areo-gel to insulate and also to make it easy to remove for service.
The common spot in the cockpit locker is occupied with heavy stuff I otherwise don't have a place for. Spare anchors, chain and such.
For the top, I have a temporary and a permanent solution. The temporary solution is a plywood top with 2" of foam, no liner covering the foam, just leaving it exposed. Modifying the original lid by adding insulation, but otherwise keeping it the same. I will screw that down without glue or expanding foam on the seams so I can take it off again. The purpose is to be able to test the whole system and make adjustments if necessary. My system/evaporator is sized for a 14 foot box. I am concerned it will freeze the whole thing and won't work for a small split system. But with adjustments I hope to make it work, and be able to freeze a fresh fish in a few hours instead of a couple days.
The more permanent lid will be a custom made lid following the plans in Nigel's refrigeration book. His technique is a lot of work, but at the same time simple in concept and doesn't require special tools or skills. Basically, you start by making a surround out of thin wood that is not unlike the surround r-parts lids look like, with a stairstep double seal, etc. Then, once that is done and setup, use it as a mold and use thin wood to make the mating part of the lid. The lid is then finished off by filling the void with expanding foam. The whole thing is then put upside down on a bench, and glue the surround to the top, which will ensure the lid and top are flush. Then add necessary foam to the bottom of the top and finish it up.
I looked hard at the r-parts lids, but unless they can custom make one to the dimensions I need they won't fit as I want. I also considered getting "real" fiberglass sheets from them, but they are just a bit further than I want to drive. They are drivable though, and it was a though at one point to get the lids from them, VIP panels from them, and the fiberglass sheet, and just make the 2 1/2 hour drive to pick them up to save shipping.
My plan for the compressor is behind the waterheater, a bit under the cabinet in an area easily accessed with the floor of the food locker removed. The previous owner built a hidden shelf back there, possibly for this purpose. It has surprisingly good ventilation, almost ideal for this, drawing up from the bilge, and exhausting behind the cabinets toward the hull deck joint, eventually into the cockpit locker area. PVC pipe will connect that area to the freezer, and I will pack the pipe with areo-gel to insulate and also to make it easy to remove for service.
The common spot in the cockpit locker is occupied with heavy stuff I otherwise don't have a place for. Spare anchors, chain and such.
Warren Holybee
Active Member
More work, more difficult to glass in the box instead of making the panels outside the box, harder to get a smooth nice finish, more expensive. I considered glassing a 4x8 sheet of 1/4 plywood, then sanding, filling, and finishing it, before cutting it to the panel sizes. That is the recommended way, but really expensive when you add up all the materials, resin, cloth, tint, filler, etc. Doing that inside the box seems really difficult, and everything I have read recommends against it for difficulty alone.