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Considering 382 purchase. Couple of questions.

NorthChannel

NorthChannel

Member
We are considering a Morgan 38 and have looked at a very clean 382 in the Midwest. I have not had the boat surveyed, but the broker as well as an old purchase survey in 2010 indicates moisture in the side decks near the gates in the lifelines. Rolf Peterson has been very helpful with this issue. However, I have another concern. When I walk up the side decks near the forward end of the coach roof, I hear a small creaking sound on both sides. In addition, the door to the forward cabin does not close. any idea what might be the problem?
 
bulkheads are tabbed to the hull, not the cabin top. my deck creaks wherever there is a bulkhead as the deck moves slightly and touches the untabbed bulkhead. not a problem, but it canbe remedied with rubber between the deck and bukkhead or, as some have done, tab the bulkheads to cabin top. not a hard job, but messy and some bulkheads are diffivult to access.
 
Thanks Terry. Makes perfect sense. Now if I can figure out why the forward cabin door is not closing. We just sold an Alberg 30 which we had for 17 years. The door not closing on Albergs is because of a breakdown of a laminated beam under the deck stepped mast. Obviously not the case here with the keel stepped mast. Just curious if anyone has any hypothesis other than warped door.
 
I would advise hiring a good experienced sailboat surveyor. These are old boats and have been treated differently over the years. Just my 2 cents.
 
Yes, I plan on a purchase survey. Ironically, one of the surveyors that has been recommended to me was probably the original dealer who sold the boat. Just trying to rule out any obvious problems which would kill a deal before I invest the $500 + in a survey.
 
Be aware that early 382's had a problem with the forward bulkhead tabbing coming detached from the hull.

Morgan provided a free repair, which most owners took advantage of, but you should check that the boat you are looking at had the repair done.

Chris
 
I purchased a 382 and had the same issue. Since I have been refitting it and pulled the mast I found that the door came back to location. What I found was the forward lower starboard shroud is attached to the forward bulkhead which was not properly tabbed to the hull and not tabbed at all to the deck which actually allowed the hull to pull towards the center line and cause the deck to bulge up directly over the door to the V berth.The fix is fairly easy. Either pull the mast or ease the rigging to allow the hull and deck to return to position and then tab the deck to the bulkhead and hull properly. I would not be afraid of this condition. The PO of my boat had over tightened the shrouds which also contributed to the condition. Good Luck and enjoy the boat.

Vern
 
Vern, this has been very helpful regarding the door mystery. An old survey that was provided to me mentions: "there is loose tabbing at the forward end of the bilge." I suspect this may be part of the problem.
 
We have completed extensive tabbing repairs and additions to our 1979 M382 Hull#115 - Tabbing Repairs Photo Album. We owned and restored a 1966 Morgan 34 and expected similar construction in the M382. Not even close. The structural bulkheads in the M382 are tabbed intermittently to the hull. None of the bulkheads are tabbed to the deck above. Much of the cabinetry in the vessel we thought to be partial bulkheads (i.e. the forward face of the ice box and the panel below the quarterbeth) were not tabbed to the hull at all.

On Pilgrim, the repair work done by during the Morgan recall was shotty and non-effective. They installed the tabbing atop paint on interior hull rather than taking the time to sand off the original paint and properly bond the repairs to the hull. Most to all of their repairs on our vessel failed. Typically if a boat was serviced during the Morgan warranty it will have a removable panel below the seat in the shower and a retrofitted partial bulkhead for the port forward lower chain plate under the cabinet in the head.

We have now added tabbing between most of the bulkheads and the deck above. For the most part this will resolve the noise you are hearing. Long term flex in the deck can cause the outer fiberglass layer to separate from the core. This issue can also cause the creaking noise you are hearing. Inspect the area carefully.

We had issues with our head door closing. This was due to poorly installed fiberglass tabbing under the threshold detaching from the plywood support beam running from the Vee berth aft to the mast bucket. There are images of our repairs / modifications to this area in the previously shared photo album.

Another area to closely inspect is the bond between the sides of the keel and the floor of the bilge / top of the holding tank. Failure of this bond is common and can be difficult to remedy.

I realize my response to your query sounds very negative. I do feel these are well designed vessels. I am eager to finish up our refit of Pilgrim and hope to travel many miles safely aboard her. After spending many many many hours tearing apart and rebuilding our M382, I am unimpressed with the general build quality. I do feel it is similar to slightly better than many other comparable vessels of the same era.

I encourage you to check out our website - M382Pilgrim.blogspot.com There are links photo albums from all of our repairs / modifications on the site.

Please let me know if you have other questions.
 
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it is my view that every new owner believes he's or her improving/fixing the M38 is right. My view is that the original Ted Brewer designed and Morgan excuted design is sailed millions of miles and still has most of the series still sailing! Granted, there are improvements and retrofits but sometimes new owners go to extremes. In my view, step back, hire or use a fellow competent sailor to give opinions on what should be done to fix/improve the boat.

Sometimes overkill, spending lots of money and/or labor must be thought of before jumping in! There are lots of Morgan's that have sailed across oceans without tearing the boat apart tabbing here and there without necessary improving the initial Brewer designed vessel.

That said, each owner should decide what he/she is comfortable with. In my view, the Morgan 38 series can go anywhere as long as the owner has the rigging and sails checked, systems okayed, and generally inspected. Sometimes, overkill in fixing can keep you from sailing, perhaps that is wrong? As an owner, you have to decide! An old boat can be a time and money pit, or you can just leave the dock or morning and go cruising.
Jim
 
Jeff, I have read and have looked at several of your photos of your refit. Thank you for sharing your experience and knowledge of the Morgan. I'm certainly not afraid of old boats having sailed a 1966 Alberg 30 all over the upper Great Lakes for the last 15 years. Would really like to join the Morgan family but being very cautious to find a good boat.
 
North Channel. Your welcome. Hope you find a suitable Morgan. I do believe the 382, 383, 384 are capable vessels and can be a good value in today's used boat market. Let me know if you have any additional questions I happy to share what we discovered while refitting Pilgrim (M382) & C'est la Vie (M34).
 
NorthChannel, Jim Ball makes a good point. We sailors in the Great White North have precious little sailing time. We can work on them or sail them from May to October. I know which one I prefer!
My boat squeeks near the head port side. If I look, I can find a few spots where tabbing has delaminated. The surveyor said I should repair...10 years ago. Somehow she keeps sailing. You know a J120 (40') weighs 2 tons less than an M-38. While the mast alone may be a good part of that difference (ha !) some of extra weight may give us a larger margin safety/error...whatever. She's a brick house.

The lifeline stanchions are mounted on the bulwarks which I do not believe are cored. They flex a bit. But I'd guess another source for deck moisture.
The ports can be a source of leaks. I chased one by rebedding stanchions. No joy. I saw signs of water in the head cabinet, check the chain plate back side of the bulkhead from inside the cabinet, Real bad leaks you can see by the port light in the salon bulkhead. But it starts on the inside of the cabinet. Likely the port in the head. And of course there's the holding tank bilge/bilge floor tabbing to check.

I think my point is that there is always something to fix on any 35 year old boat. Prioritise and take one big project on a year. Don't let a basically solid one get away because a surveyor earns his money by picking your boat apart. A Morgan 38's a comfortable, solid, pretty quick (for its day) sailboat. Price per pound you can't go wrong!
Dave
 
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